Ever Feel Like Talking is a Competition?

It's been awhile since I posted! School has been pretty hectic as usual, but I decided to take a little time to blog a bit today.

A topic I have been considering for awhile to write about is how frustrating it can be to have a conversation with my NM. I'm not even talking about the irritating comments she can make and how she can turn the silliest and simplest things into a fight. I'm referring to the style of the conversation itself and my NM's behavior during it.

When I am talking about just normal every day things with my NM, I often find myself getting extremely irritated to outright aggravated. First of all, she will take something you could have said in a few sentences and drag it out to the point that you are just waiting in aggravation for her to get to meaning of the story she's telling. There have been times that she actually FORGETS why she was telling the story because she trailed off the main point to such a degree. What the hell is that? I can't even understand why it's so difficult to talk about something with regards only to relevant details.

But this is actually something I can deal with and consider myself to have gotten used to considerably. What else my NM has been doing that I have been having a hard time keeping my patience with and I feel has become a new habit of hers, is overtalking me in conversations. It pisses me off beyond belief and seems to be happening more and more lately. She will say something and I will try to reply/comment, but she will continue talking as though words aren't even coming out of my mouth. I find it so incredibly rude and inconsiderate. I mean, isn't the purpose of conversation because you WANT the other person to talk back to you??

During this times, I feel like I am engaging in a "competition" with her to get my words out and heard. I will say something, and as her words continue to pour out, I keep trying to say whatever comment I had to make louder and louder in an attempt to make her stop talking. It's a horrible, aggravating feeling in my gut. She has to hear me trying to talk, but I guess she just doesn't care.

The major irony in the whole thing is that she often accuses me in fights of "never allowing" her to get a word in edgewise and how I'M the one always overtalking her. Talk about projection.

On a funnier and more light-hearted note, this is a video I posted on WoN several months ago and I feel it fits perfectly with this blog post. As sad as it is, this is EXACTLY how it is to reason with my NM. In fact, the donkey is actually nicer and more civil than she is.

And unrelated to this post, I want to take the time to point out that yet another member (smallbluething) who is a victim of Danu's abuse has come forward. You can read her comment on my blog post about Danu. I find it disgusting that this crap is still going on, but I am totally not surprised. Around the time I made my blog post about Danu, I gathered other information I found via internet searches on her that build upon already existing proof that she is simply up to no good. A blog entry about that will come sometime in the future.

Actually Stepping Back and Seeing

I'm currently going through one of those phases where I am very conscious of the abnormality of my relationship with my NM and her NPD. So much that I actually feel drained over just thinking of the insanity of what I am forced to do on a daily basis because of her.

I think what triggered this is that I finally got Facebook back. It's been a few years since I deleted my last account. The reason I deleted it was because I made my old Facebook connected with my NM's e-mail address. I can't even comprehend at this point HOW or WHY I did that. I can't believe I actually shared an e-mail address with her and created accounts using it. Not only would I use her e-mail, but I would tell her exactly what I was doing - every move I made, every website I registered at. I'd even leave my old e-mail messages without deleting them and she would read them. I actually foolishly believe back then that she didn't read my mail. How could I have been so conditioned to think it was normal to be enmeshed to that extent with your mother at 18 years of age?

So basically I had deleted the Facebook because it was around the time my NM's abusive insanity was reaching its peak and for some strange reason, I couldn't remove her e-mail from the account (probably because it was the one I created it with or something). I was afraid she'd somehow be able to request a password change and be able to stalk my profile. After all, she would continually ask me what my Facebook looked like and if she could see, acting as though she showed an interest when in reality, she just wanted to be in control and make sure there was nothing on my page she'd "object" to.

I made my new Facebook last week and I haven't mentioned it to her, and it's so much better this way. I don't have to hear her constant requests of me "sharing" my page with her and her asking who I'm talking to. But as liberating as it feels to have it without having to tell her anything, I still feel like my NM's leash is around my neck. When certain people add me on Facebook, I have to make sure I hide certain information, basically my relationship status because my fiance is one of the subjects my NM gets abusive over majority of the time. It's so upsetting that I can't just have my relationship status shown to everyone without any fears. Instead, I have to consider who certain people may know and how it could possibly get back to my NM. It's incredibly suffocating.

It's the same feeling when I have to go through my daily ritual with my computer - clear the history, clear the cookies, empty trash - all to make sure she can't snoop in my computer and find completely NORMAL things that she will go insane over and not leave me alone about.

It's so draining. I just don't know how a human being can do this to someone else, much less her daughter.

Life With My Narcissistic Mother

After reading through living with a narcissist's blog entries, I felt like writing a little about my own experience of living with my NMother.

Living with your mother is supposed to be a source of some of one's fondest memories in life, right? Nice long talks over coffee, warm home-cooked meals, having fun just doing the simple things life together - these are probably some of the typical thoughts that come to mind when you think of society's depiction of the ideal mother anyone would be pleased to have.

I'd be lying if I said those things weren't part of my life. I'm not going to be unfair and paint my NM as a perpetual monster who is relentlessly abusive and cruel to me. I'd be nothing more than a gaslighting liar myself, no better than my NM. Yes, I can admit that my NM can be a great person to be around when she's in one of her good moods. She can be a lot of fun to talk to and has a way of giving me a sense of security and confidence when it comes to making decisions. All of my friends who talk to her on the phone/meet her often tell me how she's "so nice" and how much they like her.

That's because they don't know there's a catch to her kindness - it's fleeting and vanishes quicker than smoke when something doesn't go her way. So long as I appease her and do not put up an opposition in any way, shape, or form, my NM will maintain her "kindness mode" (as I like to term it) and these pleasant phases can last for very long stretches of time - which makes it very easy for me to fall into the same mistakes of telling her my innermost feelings and fears that serve as her weapons against me later in her aggressive attacks.

It's actually pretty surprising how little it takes for me to push my NM into one of her attack modes. It can be something as stupid as a disagreement over something on television. Basically any difference in opinion has the potential to lead into an escalating and gaslighting argument that may or may not include physical abuse and days of silent treatment afterwards.

But even when my NM and I are not fighting and she is in a good mood, life can still be unbearable because she is engulfing and has no sense of boundaries. She has no shame in looking through my personal belongings. I have to clear the history and cookies on my laptop every time I use it to ensure she won't stalk my internet activity. I have to put screen locks on my cell phone and iPod. I can't read certain books (for example, books on NPD) because she'd DEFINITELY find it.

I basically do not have any privacy - anything I do is up for complete questioning and my NM feels completely entitled to an answer. If I text someone on my phone or sees me typing, she asks who I write to. I actually find myself conditioned to telling her who I'm talking with and what I'm talking to them about before she even asks - which is truly a sick and abnormal reality.

It pretty much feels like my NM is a ticking bomb without a visible timer - you know she's bound to explode at some point, but you can never quite tell until you hear the huge boom. Every time my NM seems quiet or "weird", I get extremely uneasy and keep asking her if she's okay. I feel so scared that she is upset about something I am unaware about and that it's a matter of time before she explodes at me. It's a heavy, terrible feeling in the pit of my stomach - pure dread. If she's not raging at me, my NM loves the good old-fashioned silent treatment as her choice of torment. So I can never tell if my NM is mad at me or my father (he's just as much a victim of her as me) for something we "did to upset her" or if she is genuinely tired/worried about something unrelated to us and her NPD.

Living with her is one of the biggest challenges in my life because at times, she makes me feel like I am losing my mind. I look forward to the day that I'm free.

The Sadistic Side of Dealing with a N: Sadistic Personality Disorder

As of lately, my NMother has been extremely abusive. She has gone into one of her "nasty" modes and is an absolute horror to live with. I guess this is what is known as intermittent "love" and abuse..and what is pathetic is that I actually fall for her crap every time when she is "loving" and let down my guard, telling her personal and sensitive things that she later uses against me.


But after the intense degree of psychological and physical abuse that has been going on these past days, I think I have really learned my lesson NOT to share things from my heart anymore. I know I always say that when she becomes abusive, but this time it feels different - as though I have learned my lesson and been kicked and bruised enough, figuratively and literally speaking.


Last night, I was thinking - her violent tendencies must be something else in addition to narcissism. She definitely has the traits of NPD. The gaslighting, my God the gaslighting. She can totally recreate reality and seems to honestly believe it. If she truly believes the series of events in various situations the way she does and is not consciously aware of it, I am actually a little scared because she warps reality that badly. She also loves to invalidate my feelings and has an overly inflated ego, believing everyone is supposed to grovel to her for the good she does. That is especially concentrated at me because she was "always the wonderful mother all my life" and I am so "ungrateful" for all she has done for me. Oh yes, wrapping your hands completely around my throat and choking me really makes me love and appreciate you. But getting back to what I was saying, from what I read about NPD, violent tendencies are not usually a key feature of the personality disorder.


So I was searching through information about various personality disorders and I found one that I think might possibly be the answer to her violent ways: Sadistic Personality Disorder. Even though I took psychology, I never heard of it before. Perhaps it's because they took it out of the DSM due to feeling it needed more research. However, it's still considered a valid personality disorder. Here's some info about it:

Has used physical cruelty or violence for the purpose of establishing dominance in a relationship (not merely to achieve some noninterpersonal goal, such as striking someone in order to rob him or her); 

Definitely describes my NM. Her goal since I decided not to be her doormat and go with everything she says is to dominate and control me constantly, and will be an absolute horror when I don't submit and give her "respect" merely because I am her daughter. The fact that she has NO respect for me means nothing; because I am her daughter, she expects respect automatically and doesn't believe it's something that is earned.

Is amused by, or takes pleasure in, the psychological or physical suffering of others (including animals) 

This is actually what made me search for another cause in addition to NPD for her insanity. When she is hitting me, she actually lookshappy in some twisted, evil way. It's hard to describe it, but when she is doing something particularly hurtful (like choking and grabbing onto me to twist my arm/hand), her eyes get really wide and she almost looks like she's smiling, as though she is getting some satisfaction or pleasure out of it. When I fight her, I never feel any of those emotions, only anger and rage, so I'm sure I don't ever look like I'm "smiling" at all. 

Gets other people to do what he or she wants by frightening them (through intimidation or even terror)

My NM used to get away with this when she first started abusing me. Now, I fight against her.

Restricts the autonomy of people with whom he or she has a close relationship, e.g., will not let spouse leave the house unaccompanied or permit teen-age daughter to attend social functions;

DEFINITELY a big trait my NM has. She has restricted my autonomy before I even realized there was something wrong with her to the point that I often feel uncomfortable and helpless in certain social situations that I shouldn't at my age (e.g.: making purchases, going certain places alone, etc.) And because I still live at home with her, she thinks she still has a right to dictate my actions regardless of the fact that I'm over the legal age. 

So I thought this might be helpful to any of you who are dealing with a physically abusive N. I hope they do more research on this disorder and add it back to DSM. Here's the link so you can read more: http://www.ptypes.com/sadisticpd.html

Your Chance to Speak The Truth About Danu Morrigan

Hello,

I just want to share a post I made today at Web of Narcissism in a topic regarding Danu and the Daughters of Narcissistic Mothers forum:

"Just a little update about the website discussed in this topic, there is a 'Health Site Award'  logo on the bottom of her page that is given by the website 'Organized Wisdom'. Considering this website abuses people, it is highly ironic and inappropriate that this is on her page, and worse, strengthens this woman's facade that ensnares unsuspecting and vulnerable victims of narcissists. 

I already contacted Organized Wisdom via this link. If anyone else reading this needs to contact them and wants to expose the truth of what goes on there, this is where to do so. I don't know if we can make a difference in helping, but we can only try."

So once again, I urge you to come forward through blogs and by contacting this website if you have been abused by Danu or know anything about what goes on at that forum. Even if it doesn't make a difference in stopping her from hurting more people, you will provide priceless validation to those who were unfortunate enough to have had a negative experience there.

- Sugar

BEWARE: Popular DoNM Forum Preys on the Emotionally Fragile

Hello everyone,


My name is Sugar and I am a member of the Web of Narcissism Forums (WoN forums; www.webofnarcissism.com). This message board is a lovely and nurturing community of individuals who have/are suffering from the effects of a narcissist in their lives. Personally, I am the daughter of a narcissistic mother and still live with her, which is very difficult to deal with, but I am hanging in there.


Before I found WoN, I was a member of the Daughters of Narcissistic Mothers forum run by a Danu Morrigan. My username there was veryluckysallycherry. This forum is the main reason for my creation of this blog in the first place. I wish to warn all of you daughters of narcissistic mothers who are seeking a safe haven for healing to AVOID Danu's forum at all costs. I, like many others who have come forward, have been abused and unjustly banned there without any explanation whatsoever. I can say with the utmost confidence that I did NOT even break any rules there. Out of the blue back in August, I received a ban and was never given the decency of a proper reason why I was being punished. Why? Because there was NO REASON. 


Let me take you further into the insanity of this dictatorship-like message board by providing you with the exact details and proof I have saved so that I could create this blog. I was banned on August 29, 2010. I was creating a topic on the board when I noticed the site was running slow. I logged out and then back in to be greeted by this message:

"You have been permanently banned from this board.

Reason given for ban: Poster disregarded Site Management's instructions of 5-13-10.

A ban has been issued on your username." 

I was completely bewildered and upset. I was sure it was a mistake, as just that day a member made a topic apologizing for accidentally breaking a rule on the forum. In this topic, Danu and Light (a mod at DoNM) provide "reassurance" and both talked of how they both "accidentally banned" themselves and members on the forum. Seems pretty odd that people running a forum can "accidentally" ban, no? I used to be an administrator myself on a message board for several years and I have NEVER accidentally banned myself or anyone else. I had to deliberately choose to ban a member and the software on the message board I worked at was the same as DoNM, phpBB. Shoddy professionalism if I have ever seen it. Sounds to me like Danu and Light's posts are a convenient way to publicly make them seem innocent so that they can just go around banning people for no apparent reason. See the proof for yourself:

Light: I accidentally banned a member, too, but she was brave and polite, and was like, "Um, gee, is there a problem with something? I got banned..." And I was like, "Yeah, you bet there's a problem... I'm a freaking idiot!"

You know who you are, brave and kind woman I banned that day -- how grateful I've been for your mercy... 

Just remember, it's nothing I haven't done to myself! 

And Danu's:

Danu: And yes, ladies, Light did ban herself . I cannot BEGIN to tell you the mileage I got out of that **chortle**. Until the day I banned myself too!  And even The Nerd, who has Admin powers and has total access to the forum, couldn't get access because of course he's on the same IP address as me and that was banned! LOL. 

After seeing these posts the very DAY I was banned for no reason (which should have been a warning sign to me, as it's just too coincidental), I created a second account just so I could contact the first staff member I saw online to find out what exactly was going on. Seeing that Light was online, I contacted her explaining the strange no-reason ban and asking what was happening. A few minutes after sending the PM, I noticed it was opened and I received no reply from Light. Yet another odd sign. I checked again hours later - still no reply. Not knowing what was going on, I decided to contact Danu asking what was going on. To no surprise, I did not receive a reply from her either. 


In the meantime, on the second account I created, I was reading through EVERY one of my posts from May 13th made with the veryluckysallycherry account to see if there was anything that could have been taken up as a violation of rules and there was not a single thing that was offensive in my posts. Moreover, I knew that I had never received any instructions from site management on May 13th.


But things get even MORE insane on the day of August 29th, believe it or not. As I was on the forum reading through my posts, I noticed a new topic by Light in the General Discussion forum titled "missred" (the name of a recently registered user at the time - as a side note, if you are reading this missred, I hope you do not mind me using you as an example to expose Danu and Light's corruption. I will not expose any of your personal information). This post clearly belonged in a private staff forum, but somehow ended up in the public general discussion. I find it quite odd though, that THREE staff members participated in the topic and not one seemed to notice that it was in the wrong forum so that their gossiping was viewable to all. Take a look at what Light says about this member:

Light: member's name is missred

This post scared the crap out of me. Would you guys have a look? I put it in the Q for a bit. I don't know what to think. All I know is, to be honest, I don't want her here after reading that. Maybe that's not really fair, but maybe it's something I should listen to carefully. Like I said, I'm not too sure just yet. I think I need time to think about it. Let's chat about this?

It would have been one thing if she'd said she got into trouble as a kid or something, but this felt like a lot more than that, and I'm feeling pretty uncomfortable with her...

I don't know about missred. There's something that isn't sitting right with me about that post. I just get an intuitive fearful feeling. 

Wow. Just..wow. I remember reading missred's posts and nothing gave me an "intuitive fearful feeling". She just wrote about her experiences with having a NM in the "My Story" section of the forum, which is meant just for that - SHARING YOUR STORY. They removed her story and even picked on this member in this topic for posting asking where her story went and stating that she hoped she had not broken any rules. Apparently, this had made Light suspicious as she also commented that it was "strange" for her to worry about being banned for breaking rules (I apologize, I do not have the direct quote for that). So..now it's strange for a member to question where their topic went when administration removed it and hope that this did not mean she had broken rules? Sounds like a certain staff member is a bit paranoid. Or at least looking for a reason to drop the ban ax on yet another member.


I guess this must be how they tear up all of their members behind the scenes? They must have had a field day with me, since I talked of how my NM is physically abusive at times. It's pretty odd that these women are running a message board and are willing to so easily ban people on "intuition" instead of PROOF of actual wrongdoing. What's even more disgusting is they are persecuting people for talking about their experiences when their half-assed-run forum is supposed to be for HEALING. What's more, I'd like to know how Light can get "intuition" from text on a screen without seeing or hearing a person speaking.


I felt terrible when I saw missred reply apologetically and offering to deactivate her account. After she replied, the topic magically vanished where I assume it was moved to its proper forum.


Do you see how these women irresponsibly run their forum without even having the "decency" to make sure their catty tearing up of members is kept secret? They could care less if they leave emotionally fragile daughters of narcissists feeling blamed and embarrassed. Danu and Light are TAKING THE PLACE of our narcissistic mothers' roles complete with gaslighting and invalidation in a place that is supposed to be meant for HEALING! This is an outrage and just plain nauseating.


Getting back to my experience, when I checked back again later to see if Danu or Light had responded to me, I was greeted with this message upon logging in:

You have been permanently banned from this board.

A ban has been issued on your IP address.

I couldn't believe it. I wrote one last message to Danu demanding an explanation, but as you can probably predict, I never got a reply. 


I was and still am incredibly thankful that by doing a google search of bans at Daughters of Narcissistic Mothers forum, I found Soaring Dove's blog. It gave me the validation that I so desperately needed - that I was not alone or had done anything wrong, but rather Danu and her cohorts are a bunch of insensitive, money hungry individuals who use the emotionally fragile psyches of abused daughters to make an easy buck. All you need to do is go to Danu's website to see the money signs staring you right in the face. She is constantly ramming the EFT (Emotional Freedom Technique) down people's throats as if it's a cure-all to psychological problems and making her own little DVDs/booklets as if she invented it. She also looks for donations and states that they are used to pay her bills. There is even an Amazon link at the top of her page and it says next to it, "If you make your purchases through this link it will help with the running costs of this site." So many things scream, "GIVE ME MONEY" on her site, it's sickening. Soaring Dove delves into deeper description about this in addition to her own experience with Danu, so see her blog to learn more. This is her latest blog entry about Danu's dirty deeds.


Interestingly enough, my google search showed another ex-member abused at the hands of Danu. Here is the link and I will provide the excerpt:

"I wanted to thank you for accepting me not only to your Facebook page, but again for posting my story to your website. To my dismay, I tried to join that Daughters Of Narcissistic Mothers website which was so pinpoint accurate to my gruesome upbringing and wherein Danu said "everybody" was welcome, but she yanked my posts (which were mild/toned down as opposed to the graphic one I'd posted on your website) and she banned me, claiming I wouldn't be helped "whatsoever" by joining her website, which she said was for everyone. I was shocked, for I was being honest; would it have been better if I had sugar-coated or lied about my existence? [...] I was very polite and honest and cannot fathom why my posts could have been deemed offensive or how on Earth that woman, who doesn't even use her real name, could sit in on judgement (I know it's judgment, but think it looks wrong without that "E" on there) when all I did was ask to read what everybody had posted. I just am so upset to be shunned by yet somebody else whose existence practically mirrored mine."

Here you have it, yet another member unjustly banned from Danu's forum. It's real nice to tell someone they can't be helped and ban them, isn't it? Danu and her staff ban people for multiple insane reasons, not just the crazy unclear code of conduct at her forum. The place is nothing more than an online dictatorship. After my veryluckysallycherry account was banned and I viewed it from the second account, it did not appear banned - it looked as though I was still an active member. God only knows how many people are banned and shut out, while the remaining members are lulled by a false sense of comfort. Sure, it just "appears" that a once very active member like myself who was randomly banned just decided to stop posting. There is no "banned" title below their name as is seen at many other message boards. Same goes for topics they feel are "too sensitive" - they make them "disappear" as they do with members. Danu takes people she feels are a threat to her narcissistic ego and discards them like yesterday's trash, all the while maintaing her glorified image as the caring and well-spoken administrator. The biggest joke of all is the "Health Site Award" on the bottom of her page.


I still wonder at times what it was about me that Danu saw as a threat and made her to decide to cut me off without warning. Her excuse for getting rid of Soaring Dove was merely mentioning her religion and the girl whose post I quoted above was banned for posting "too sensitive" information. I never spoke about my faith and I never had posts of mine deleted, so I really have no clue why they prefabricated a non-existent reason to ban me. Perhaps because I never donated money? Who knows, and who really cares. I found a wonderful place at WoN and if Danu had never banned me, I would probably still be posting at that dictatorship.


What I do care about is getting the truth out and spreading it to all daughters of narcissistic mothers, whether you are contemplating joining Danu's forum or are currently a member there. I know it may be hard for you to realize if you are currently posting there, I can speak from experience. What hurt the most when I was banned from that place was that I was torn away from the friendships I had established with the lovely women there without a way to contact them. The fear of losing those friendships and the validation you receive from your friends at that place is definitely enough to blind you to the proof of Danu's insanity - but I urge you to open your eyes to the truth that all of us unjustly banned ex-members offer to you. I, along with anyone else who has come forward, have nothing to gain by speaking about what has happened to us. I'm not trying to get you to join WoN or any other online group. The purpose of this blog is to warn and save you from hurt. Maybe you will be lucky enough to be spared from a ban, but maybe not. As I said, I still can't come up with a reason for my ban, so Danu clearly doesn't ban with rationality guiding her.


Interestingly enough, Danu replied to Soaring Dove's blog recently, which is full of what I see as pretty big indicators of NPD. If you ask me, I think her decision to respond is because she's starting to worry about all the people beginning to come out and speak about her dirty deeds. Honestly, does she really believe treating her members as though they are expendable would result in them staying silent and not complaining about the injustice done to them? 


Bottom line is, everyone's dirty deeds eventually come to the surface and I am very glad that I have finally found the time in my busy schedule to write this blog entry. I can only hope that more and more people continue to come forward with their stories to provide even more validation for the abused and insight to those blinded by Danu's glittering generalities. In conclusion, I feel that it is absolutely disgusting to take advantage of and abuse people who are emotionally fragile because they are easy, trusting targets for the first sign of understanding/validation. Danu, you should be ashamed of yourself.


- Sugar